Suggestions for recording acoustic drums via midi???

mattj wrote on 4/22/2009, 6:37 PM

So...

I've got MMM12 (yeah it's old) and I CANNOT play an acoustic drumset. So what I've always done is tap out the BD and snare beats on one MIDI track, then tap out the cymbals on another MIDI track, then tap out the toms and fills all on another midi track using 3 separate virtual instruments. Lastly, I sync everything up right manually. My input device has always been (pleeeeease don't laugh) a cheap old Cassio keyboard with MIDI ins and outs and my computer has MIDI ins and outs too.

This has always worked VERY well for me and even all my drummer friends couldn't tell I had used a cheap keyboard for the drum track. However...

...Now some friends of mine that are in a band want me to record them. No problem. EXCEPT FOR THE DRUMS!!!!! The vocals, guitars, bass, keyboard, and synths all sound GREAT! But my recording of the acoustic drums sounds TERRIBLE!!!

My solution for the first song was to (grrrrrrrrrrrrr...#^&$\#%^!!) re-record the ENTIRE drum track by myself using my aforementioned method matching EXACTLY what the drummer played TO THE T. All his beats were simple so it really wasn't hard, BUT IT SEEMS LIKE SUCH A WASTE OF MY TIME AND HIS TALLENT!!!! He really is a great drummer, but I'M just not skilled enough yet at capturing acoustic drum sounds with even the HQ mikes we were using.

SO MY QUESTION IS... (drumroll please... ;P )

Does anybody know of some good brands of acoustic drum triggers that are MIDI compatable that I can use with MMM12?

...preferably cheap... *cough* *cough* we're not doing anything fancy, I just want to hook up triggers to his acoustic drum set and "somehow" plug them into the midi in on my computer to use his acoustic set AS my MIDI input device instead of my old keyboard.

Does anyone have any experience with any SPECIFIC brands?

Thanks!

Comments

NoTurning wrote on 4/22/2009, 7:42 PM

Hi,
I share your pain!!! Drums are EXTREEMLY hard to record well. I can't suggest MIDI triggers for drums because I don't like those either.

Your best bet is to get a good set of drum mics (yes it takes several) and a small mixer. Then you can mix down all the drum mics into a single channel and it will sound good; add some reverb and you have a good drum track.

Justin

NoTurning wrote on 4/23/2009, 9:35 AM

I see your dilemma... I use a drum machine for our band because it records GREAT and it has MIDI out. Probably not a great solution for you though. If you go to my MEDIA page here on Magix you can listen to our song Exposed that was recorded with the drum machine.

I don't know how your drummer feels about this but we've had a MIDI drum set and that is an awesome solution. It's plays like acoustic drums, it sets up like an acoustic set and is pure MIDI goodness.

I'm not a big fan of the midi drum pick-ups because they impede the acoustic sound and don't accurately represent what was played. If you can swing it get a MIDI drum set - we can't afford it so we're playing the drum machine and the QWERTY.

Also... one or two good condenser mics can do a great job recording drums. I hesitate to recommend this as condensers are very sensitive and if placed too close they will be damaged from the sound pressure of the drums. I recommend omni-directional condensers set up in a stereo pair (though I heard of good results with one) and spend some time with mic placement. I can be done.

Justin

PS - Props for hashing out the drums on your Casio, those of us who've been there congratulate you. Post some tracks here for us to listen to.

silentsky wrote on 4/24/2009, 11:02 AM

Hi, I completely agree--acoustic drums are by far the most difficult instrument to record and get a decent sound. And I'm a drummer, so I'm probably even more particular about how they sound.

In my experience, the raw, recorded drum tracks sound pretty un-impressive when I've first recorded them. However, when you begin to mix them, by applying EQ, compression, tape saturation, reverb, etc., they often begin to sound much better.

But if you're stuck with a recorded drum track that you just can't seem to salvage, I would recommend trying a Drum Replacement VST plugin. There are several of these that are available for free, along with several that are commercial. I use one called Aptrigga. What these plugins allow you to do is to choose a pre-recorded WAV sample of a good-sounding drum and totally replace any hits on your track with it. It's really helped me out. If you'll go read this article, it explains the process and has links to several freebies:

http://www.hometracked.com/2006/04/29/free-drum-replacers/

Hope this helps,

Jon

silentsky wrote on 4/30/2009, 2:20 PM

Hey Matti,

I use Aptrigga, which allows you to simply substitute a WAV sample note-for-note for the recorded drum hits. I've never tried using KTDrumTrigger to generate MIDI events. If I have some time in the next couple of days, I'll try to play around with it and see what I can come up with.

Jon

Edit: I just did a quick Google search and came up with some links for you to take a look at:

http://koen.smartelectronix.com/KTDrumTrigger/KTDrumTrigger%20and%20its%20hosts.txt

http://www.gearslutz.com/board/so-much-gear-so-little-time/343034-there-any-way-convert-wav-hits-into-midi.html

Let me know how it turns out.