Error trying to use audio interface.

emmrecs wrote on 6/14/2021, 3:32 AM

Welcome to the Magix user to user forums.

I agree it is somewhat strange that MEP, and its big brother VPX, do not make use of ASIO as the driver model. However, on my system I use the Wave Driver option, which works without problem, generally, until I see the same error message as you are receiving!

The answer, in my case, is always that the sound device, here a MOTU 8-Pre, has been reset, often by Windows (in its infinite stupidity) to a sample rate different to what MEP/VPX wants! MEP will almost certainly be set to 48kHz and Windows is likely to have set/reset your audio interface to 44.1kHz! Forcing it to switch back can sometimes be achieved here by opening the MOTU Audio Control Panel but can involve going into Sounds (via right-click on the volume icon in the SysTray), going to the playback tab, highlighting your desired interface, clicking on Properties, going to the Advanced tab and there ensuring that Default Format is set to 48kHz!

And yes, I always have "Windows Sounds" turned completely off!

HTH

Jeff
Forum Moderator

Alan-Bvid wrote on 6/14/2021, 3:19 PM

Hi Jeff @emmrecs -

Thanks for responding! Actually that part was ok, but then what I thought to check was the bit-rate. Because Magix Movie Edit Pro doesn't seem to work with anything beyond 16-bit audio. So I changed that in the Sounds settings. But that didn't fix it, so then I did 16-bit 44.1 for playback and record and changed it to "CD quality" in Magix. Still didn't work. So then I got another interface that's actually nicer than the Apollo (which is already studio level gear) but that didn't work either.

I'm thinking Magix may just not be professional enough to use anything beyond consumer level gear with. The fact that there's not ASIO support kind of indicates that. Also there's no mention of bit-rate in the Magix settings, they just use something they think a non-sound person can relate to like "cd audio" or "dat audio".

Thanks for your help though! Maybe in the future Magix will get where they need to be but for now I'm going to have to look for something else. I'm open to suggestions if anyone has any. Am trying to not go the Premiere route.

Best regards,

Alan

CubeAce wrote on 6/14/2021, 4:15 PM

@Alan-Bvid

Hi Alan.

Actually MEP and VPX use the Magix Low latency 2016 (V2.13) ASIO driver by default which is a version of the ASIO4All driver. As I'm using an inboard RealTek sound chip though that may make a difference. The settings can't be accessed via the program. Only the buffer settings seem to be able to be changed in the program settings. The ASIO driver does not appear in the task bar as it would when using another application. I have no idea why.

There are Windows settings that could be upsetting the use of a different audio driver. Whatever driver is set to be used it should have the 'Allow applications to take exclusive control of this device' selected under the speakers or whatever output you are using that is selected.

I am using that ASIO driver at 24 bit 48 kHz within MEP and VPX.

Ray.

emmrecs wrote on 6/14/2021, 4:19 PM

@Alan-Bvid

As I indicated above, I run a “professional studio” audio interface (MOTU 8-Pre) for all my video and audio work (you can see in my signature that I run a range of professional apps, both audio and video).

As I wrote before, occasionally Windows interferes with my audio and forces changes to the Sample Rate of the interface. Bit Rate of 16 bit is the default standard for video.

Your mention of “CD Quality” setting suggests you were looking in the Windows settings screen I mentioned before. The alternative to that is “DVD Quality” which is 48kHz. Did you try that?

I honestly don’t think you need to look for something else.

Jeff

johnebaker wrote on 6/14/2021, 4:28 PM

@Alan-Bvid

Hi

. . . . I'm thinking Magix may just not be professional enough to use anything beyond consumer level gear with. The fact that there's not ASIO support kind of indicates that. . . .

According to UA - the UA Apollo twin USB driver, shown selected in the image you posted, is the correct WDM driver for recording from the Apollo into software on a computer eg Movie Edit Pro (MEP) via USB.

The Music Maker ASIO settings are not relevant - the settings you are showing are for audio playback from MMM to the Apollo.

However if you have Music Maker running at the same time as MEP, this may be a cause of the issue as described in the error message ie it cannot open the device because it is being blocked, however MEP does not know what it is being blocked by.

. . . . Movie Edit Pro doesn't seem to work with anything beyond 16-bit audio . . . .

Movie Edit Pro will handle 24 bit audio at a range of 'standard' bitrates' depending on the format.

Check that the Apollo, Windows and MEP are all set to either 44.1 kHz or 48.0 kHz sample rate, bitrate.

HTH

John EB
Forum Moderator

Alan-Bvid wrote on 6/14/2021, 11:25 PM

@johnebaker

Hi John and Jeff and Ray - Thanks for responding. I've tried all of these configurations, numerous times, and sometimes with reboots in-between just in case a setting wasn't being picked up immediately by something immediately for some reason.

Maybe it would be helpful if I was more specific with other settings, maybe something else I have set is incorrect. I just attempted the following:

Rebooted with these settings:

In the Control Panel -> Sound -> Apollo settings -> Recording tab -> Listen to this device is off.

In Windows settings Allow Access to this mic is off (svchost was using it if i had it on, I've tried that way too).

In Control Panel -> Sound -> Recording tab -> Properties for the Apollo there are no bitrate or rate settings. The Apollo itself via its control panel is set to 44.100, although it should be getting that info from the Windows WDM settings. Anyway, its correct.

Playback tab - Speakers Properties for Apollo -> Advanced tab set to 16-bit 44.1. Clicking Test gives audio. Allow applications to take exclusive control is unchecked.

Then from there open MEP, Create a project with a 44.1 bit rate.

File -> Settings -> Program -> Playback tab -> Driver selection is Wave driver and output device is the Apollo.

Go to Record, Audio driver is the Apollo (UA Twin USB), Recording quality is CD Audio. Advanced Settings -> Real time adjustment of sample rate is checked (its the default).

I've also done this at 48k. Also, MM is not running nor is anything else that would be using the Apollo. That would give a different error anyway, it would say the device is in use.

I'm willing to try anything anyone suggests that is reasonable.

Thanks guys!

Best,

Alan

Alan-Bvid wrote on 6/14/2021, 11:36 PM

Also - With the settings above I can open up MM and record just fine.

CubeAce wrote on 6/15/2021, 1:23 AM

@Alan-Bvid

Have you tried checking 'Allow applications to take exclusive control'?.

Default setting for video requirements should really be 48kHz.

Check all inputs and outputs are active in the sound recorder settings.

I notice there are at least ten versions of this device. Is yours thunderbolt or USB?

I have no idea of what the variations of the product mean in real terms.

Ray.

johnebaker wrote on 6/15/2021, 4:28 AM

@Alan-Bvid

I think we are missing something here.

Are you trying to record vocals and /or instruments for an existing video on the timeline either as a backing track for the video or the video as the background to the audio?

If so there is another way which, IMHO, is a better way.

Export the video from MEP as a WMV file.
Using Music Maker (MMM) - load the WMV file onto track 1 in Music Maker and turn on the video monitor (F12 key)
Record your audio.
Make all audio adjustments etc in MMM

At this point you have 2 options:

Export the video and audio from MMM as a video file - however this is limited to AVI or WMV formats.

or
Export the finished audio as a WAV file, if the video has any audio you may not want to include this.

In MEP import the WAV file and adjust to sync with the video.

Export as your music video to the required format eg MP4.

As I previously commented do not run MEP and MMM at the same time.

HTH

John EB

Alan-Bvid wrote on 6/15/2021, 5:51 PM

@CubeAce - Yes, i've changed it to allow exclusive control, also set back to 48k, still nothing.

@johnebaker - No, not for an existing video. I need to show some people how to use some software so i'm doing screen capture with a running audio track at the same time. I need to be able to do them at the same time.

Rather than try to just record audio to test I attempted doing a screen capture with audio and got a similar but different error message.

For whatever reason Magix doesn't want to talk to the Apollo. Any other ideas?

Thanks!

CubeAce wrote on 6/15/2021, 6:03 PM

@Alan-Bvid

Hi Alan.

You said.

I need to show some people how to use some software so i'm doing screen capture with a running audio track at the same time.

So do you have 'Stereo mix' enabled within your audio interface? In Win 10 it is normally turned off by default and can often even be hidden in the control panel.

Ray.

Alan-Bvid wrote on 6/15/2021, 7:47 PM

@CubeAce

The interface is putting out 2 channels, i can see it in the meters, in Control Panel -> Sound -> Recording there is no Stereo Mix device in there.

Alan-Bvid wrote on 6/15/2021, 8:00 PM

And now there's another option for the Apollo in the dropdown for screen capturing, however when i record the record timer doesn't run (it will though if i don't try to record audio).

MEP just isn't made to work with studio grade hardware. And while it does show another driver that it doesn't complain about when I do a screen capture it won't actually record audio, the record timer doesn't run, and the Stop button doesn't work. I have to use Task Manager to kill off MEP.

I appreciate all the help but this software isn't up for what i'm trying to do. I've burned 4 days on this and have to move on. I'm looking at Premiere Element, Corel Videostudio, Cyberlink Powerdirector, there is lots of other software out there that hopefully can do this not-very-hard task. I'm going to ask for my money back from Magix and find something better.

Thanks for all the help.

Best regards,

Alan

CubeAce wrote on 6/15/2021, 8:05 PM

@Alan-Bvid

Then there is no way of combining two programs audio outputs.

Are you sure that when you right click inside the playback or record section of the panel there are not these options?

Ray.

Alan-Bvid wrote on 6/15/2021, 8:16 PM

I have those options and they are checked. But there is no "Stereo Mix" in that list.

Alan-Bvid wrote on 6/15/2021, 8:51 PM

And I just recorded audio with the mic and played it back in MM. I don't see how this is anything other than a MEP problem. If you have any other suggestions I'll try them, but at the same time currently downloading other editors to check out.

CubeAce wrote on 6/16/2021, 1:18 AM

@Alan-Bvid

Hi Alan.

Maybe I should have been more precise with my reply. I should have said 'Without a Stereo Mix option I know of no other way to get two programs within Windows to share audio with each other. Without that I could not use Cubase and MEP with each other. However if you do find another video editor that will do this without that function I would be interested if you reported back.

I'm sorry this has been a futile attempt so far for you.

Ray.

emmrecs wrote on 6/16/2021, 3:33 AM

@Alan-Bvid

MEP just isn't made to work with studio grade hardware

Please do not make such sweeping and wholly incorrect assertions in the forum. The fact that what you want to do does not work on your system is certainly no proof that MEP cannot use studio grade hardware.

I previously wrote that I am using a MOTU 8-Pre Audio Interface; I trust you will accept it is studio grade hardware? You have previously been advised that it is not possible to get two programs within Windows to share audio with each other unless you have, and can activate the Stereo Mix option. If you cannot do so perhaps you should aim your comments to Microsoft, who, under pressure from the RIAA, have hidden or even disabled it on many modern computers.

Jeff

CubeAce wrote on 6/16/2021, 4:29 AM

@Alan-Bvid @emmrecs @johnebaker

I did find this information on the uaudio website.

Assuming I have the correct product selected this seems to infer that the audio interface is incapable of connecting to two programs at once. The interface would only be available to the last opened program.

You may also want to read this blog spot. There are also other forums where this is discussed.

Ray.

johnebaker wrote on 6/16/2021, 5:41 AM

@Alan-Bvid

Hi

. . . . I need to show some people how to use some software so i'm doing screen capture with a running audio track at the same time. I need to be able to do them at the same time. . . .

If you are trying to stream this - then MEP is the wrong program to use.

If the 'software' is Music Maker or similar and is using the ASIO driver for input and/or output then it is not possible for other programs to uses/access the sound card. I have not got the Windows option that @CubeAce suggested to work

You could try downloading and installing ASIO4All and using this for 'software' drivers.

The other option is to capture the video and then do a voice over afterwards - this is how I worked for the tutorials I have created with voice over.

HTH

John EB

CubeAce wrote on 6/16/2021, 11:44 AM

@Alan-Bvid @emmrecs

Hi Alan.

I just noticed earlier you had written.

In Windows settings Allow Access to this mic is off (svchost was using it if i had it on, I've tried that way too).

It is a monitoring program within Windows 10 that helps Windows to know which program is trying to access your camera of microphone for security reasons. Turning it off sometimes prevents some programs from accessing other inputs. It does no harm leaving it on.

@johnebaker

Hi John.

I don't know if this will help or not. Do you use an inboard RealTek audio chip?

Please forgive the poor musicianship, it's something I'm toying with at present.

johnebaker wrote on 6/16/2021, 2:52 PM

Hi Ray

I will try that, this is what I get with my screen recording software and MMM

Update:

The only way I can get MEP to record Music Maker audio is using either the Wave Driver or Direct Sound driver however this means I then cannot hear the recording of Instruments while playing them.

Using ASIO4All is the only way I can hear and record audio playing an instrument from MMM.

The music is to my taste 👍.

John EB

CubeAce wrote on 6/16/2021, 4:07 PM

@johnebaker

Hi John.

I haven't tried MMM as yet but I was using the Magix 2016 audio driver for Cubase. I can't tell the difference between that and the ASI4ALL driver. The interfaces of both are identical. Using ASIO4ALL though fails. I suspect because MEP and VPX is stuck with the Magix ASIO version. Within the Windows mixer the default audio device is Stereo mix. This is then swapped for the mic input. Hence the mic input shows activity when there is no microphone connected. This gives an audio output from the stereo mix with the stereo mix fader off. You can see a faint ghost level from it in the video which is still accurate level wise but the level is set with the speaker output into MEP or VPX. This means having to set my amplifiers volume quite low for monitoring I have no idea how loud a volume you would get in headphones if you had to plug them into the computers headphone out jack.

I do know that setting up MMM on my system is different to setting up Cubase and doesn't work on my default settings.

Ray.

Alan-Bvid wrote on 6/16/2021, 9:53 PM

@CubeAce @johnebaker @emmrecs

I am not trying to connect to 2 programs at once. I only mentioned MM to state that I could use the Apollo in MM. I'm not trying to use MM at the same time, or any other program at the same time. I'm only trying to record Screen Capture audio and video in MEP.

Also, I'm not streaming. I'm just trying to record a screen capture with audio at the same time. I do not want to record the video and then record the audio later, it needs to be at the same time.

>> You could try downloading and installing ASIO4All and using this for 'software' drivers.

I've had that installed for a while. I can't change the Apollo to use that driver instead of the Apollo driver though because there is no inf file, just the dll.

>> I previously wrote that I am using a MOTU 8-Pre Audio Interface; I trust you will accept it is studio grade hardware?

I know video people that use MOTU devices in their video studios. But audio studios are different, and you aren't going to find a MOTU in any professional recording studio. For one thing especially when using nice mics you want to pair it with an appropriate preamp -- they have names like Neve, SSL, Chandler, Great River, Avalon... And the converter is critically important as well and not combined with preamps usually unlike the MOTU. Some good converters are Mytek, Lavry, SSL, Prism, Universal Audio. While my UA Apollo and Prism are high-quality converters they also have very nice pre-amps built in, but I can also use separate preamps if I want and just use them for AD conversion. In the audio world this is critically important in crafting a sound that is desired for the source.

Thanks,

Alan