@CubeAce

Hi Ray,

Christian is running MEP 2020, according to his version number. Are those settings not something new for the 2021 version?

Jeff

@emmrecs@emmrecs

Hi Jeff.

I shouldn't think so, it has more to do with how Windows is working than MEP. Changing those settings has helped with other older programs running on my machine.

Ray.

Hi Ray,

1. My video card is comming up and the settings is set to Direct3D.

2. The resolution of my project is 1920*1080, 29.97 fps

Windows is also up to date and I have plenty of free memory (both RAM & disk) when I work and render my project so I don't think that's an issue.

@Chrilles

At 1080p you should not be having problems and I agree at that resolution your amount of ram should be adequate but don't count on drive space being used as memory as being useful. If your files are coming from a new mobile phone or some models of Go-Pro camera that could be a source of a problem, hence I asked the source of the files as well as the resolution.

In theory I can't see any reason you are having any problems at all unless there is something in the coding of the video files MEP doesn't like, such as a variable frame rate. If you could download the free MediaInfo tool to look at the files internal data there could be an anomaly causing a problem but beyond that I can't think of any reason you should be suffering a freezing of the program apart from a lack of free space on the C: drive for the program to move files around.

If it is not that you may well have to take this up with Magix support staff unless anyone else here has fresh ideas as to what is going on.

You said in your first post you did finally get MEP to export the project without the program freezing. That reducing the amount of cores seemed to help. That may be worth asking about with the magix staff.

Ray.

@Chrilles

Hi

Can you clarify your comment:

. . .  The resolution of my project is 1920*1080, 29.97 fps . . . .

Is that the Project setting, the source video resolution or both.

What is the video format of the source videos you are adding to the timeline - a MediaInfo analysis would help - post the results from the Tree view.

John EB
Forum Moderator

@Chrilles

Hi

Can you clarify your comment:

. . .  The resolution of my project is 1920*1080, 29.97 fps . . . .

Is that the Project setting, the source video resolution or both.

What is the video format of the source videos you are adding to the timeline - a MediaInfo analysis would help - post the results from the Tree view.

John EB
Forum Moderator

Hi John,
Both the project and the media files has resolution 1920*1080 except a few clips that has only 640*480.

/Christian

@Chrilles

Hi Christian

Thanks for clarifying. That rules out a higher resolution video overloading the system.

John EB

@Chrilles @johnebaker

Hi Christian.

We would still need to see the data from MediaInfo on the different file types being used. Sometimes we see oddities in the files that cause problems.

Ray.

Here are the two types of videos I use. (Sorry, but I couldn't upload textfiles)

General
Complete name                      : F:\MovieEditPro\Adven Mk 2020\DSC_8509_910C39D7.MOV
Format                                   : MPEG-4
Format profile                         : QuickTime
Codec ID                                 : qt   2007.09 (qt  /niko)
File size                                : 404 MiB
Duration                                 : 2 min 31 s
Overall bit rate                         : 22.3 Mb/s
Encoded date                             : UTC 2020-11-22 17:28:21
Tagged date                              : UTC 2020-11-22 17:28:21
NCDT                                     : NCTG

Video
ID                                       : 1
Format                                   : AVC
Format/Info                              : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile                           : High@L4.1
Format settings                          : CABAC / 2 Ref Frames
Format settings, CABAC                   : Yes
Format settings, Reference frames        : 2 frames
Format settings, GOP                     : M=3, N=15
Codec ID                                 : avc1
Codec ID/Info                            : Advanced Video Coding
Duration                                 : 2 min 31 s
Bit rate                                 : 20.8 Mb/s
Width                                    : 1 920 pixels
Height                                   : 1 080 pixels
Display aspect ratio                     : 16:9
Frame rate mode                          : Constant
Frame rate                               : 29.970 (30000/1001) FPS
Color space                              : YUV
Chroma subsampling                       : 4:2:0
Bit depth                                : 8 bits
Scan type                                : Progressive
Bits/(Pixel*Frame)                       : 0.334
Stream size                              : 375 MiB (93%)
Language                                 : English
Encoded date                             : UTC 2020-11-22 17:28:21
Tagged date                              : UTC 2020-11-22 17:28:21
Color range                              : Full
Color primaries                          : BT.709
transfer_characteristics_Original        : BT.470 System M
Matrix coefficients                      : BT.601
Codec configuration box                  : avcC

Audio
ID                                       : 2
Format                                   : PCM
Format settings                          : Little / Signed
Codec ID                                 : sowt
Duration                                 : 2 min 31 s
Bit rate mode                            : Constant
Bit rate                                 : 1 536 kb/s
Channel(s)                               : 2 channels
Channel layout                           : L R
Sampling rate                            : 48.0 kHz
Bit depth                                : 16 bits
Stream size                              : 27.8 MiB (7%)
Language                                 : English
Encoded date                             : UTC 2020-11-22 17:28:21
Tagged date                              : UTC 2020-11-22 17:28:21

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

General
Complete name                            : F:\MovieEditPro\Adven Mk 2020\VID_20201122_173640_E7847577.mp4
Format                                   : MPEG-4
Format profile                           : Base Media / Version 2
Codec ID                                 : mp42 (isom/mp42)
File size                                : 23.3 MiB
Duration                                 : 37 s 248 ms
Overall bit rate mode                    : Variable
Overall bit rate                         : 5 257 kb/s
Encoded date                             : UTC 2020-11-22 16:36:40
Tagged date                              : UTC 2020-11-22 16:36:40
com.android.version                      : 9

Video
ID                                       : 1
Format                                   : AVC
Format/Info                              : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile                           : Baseline@L3
Format settings                          : 1 Ref Frames
Format settings, CABAC                   : No
Format settings, Reference frames        : 1 frame
Format settings, GOP                     : M=1, N=30
Codec ID                                 : avc1
Codec ID/Info                            : Advanced Video Coding
Duration                                 : 37 s 248 ms
Bit rate mode                            : Variable
Bit rate                                 : 5 000 kb/s
Width                                    : 640 pixels
Height                                   : 480 pixels
Display aspect ratio                     : 4:3
Frame rate mode                          : Variable
Frame rate                               : 29.881 FPS
Minimum frame rate                       : 4.508 FPS
Maximum frame rate                       : 42.980 FPS
Original frame rate                      : 30.000 FPS
Color space                              : YUV
Chroma subsampling                       : 4:2:0
Bit depth                                : 8 bits
Scan type                                : Progressive
Bits/(Pixel*Frame)                       : 0.545
Stream size                              : 22.1 MiB (95%)
Title                                    : VideoHandle
Language                                 : English
Encoded date                             : UTC 2020-11-22 16:36:40
Tagged date                              : UTC 2020-11-22 16:36:40
Color range                              : Limited
Color primaries                          : BT.601 NTSC
Transfer characteristics                 : BT.709
Matrix coefficients                      : BT.601
mdhd_Duration                            : 37248
Codec configuration box                  : avcC

Audio
ID                                       : 2
Format                                   : AAC LC
Format/Info                              : Advanced Audio Codec Low Complexity
Codec ID                                 : mp4a-40-2
Duration                                 : 37 s 141 ms
Bit rate mode                            : Constant
Bit rate                                 : 96.0 kb/s
Channel(s)                               : 2 channels
Channel layout                           : L R
Sampling rate                            : 48.0 kHz
Frame rate                               : 46.875 FPS (1024 SPF)
Compression mode                         : Lossy
Stream size                              : 436 KiB (2%)
Title                                    : SoundHandle
Language                                 : English
Encoded date                             : UTC 2020-11-22 16:36:40
Tagged date                              : UTC 2020-11-22 16:36:40
mdhd_Duration                            : 37141

The audiotracks are standard wav (PCM) files 2-channel (stereo) 16bit 48KHz

@Chrilles

Hi Christian.

It is as me and John suspected. The problem lies with the second file type.

It is variable frame rate and varies wildly in frame speed.

From your second file.

Frame rate mode                          : Variable
Frame rate                               : 29.881 FPS
Minimum frame rate                       : 4.508 FPS
Maximum frame rate                       : 42.980 FPS
Original frame rate                      : 30.000 FPS

MEP is trying to produce a constant frame rate file and doesn't know how to fill the gaps or which frames to dump when it goes above or below the selected frame rate of the export.

That's one of the wildest frame rate discrepancies I've ever seen posted so far.

If it can be converted to constant frame rate by a file conversion program like Handbrake (which is free to download) the the resulting file may be able to be used in MEP.

This is a common problem we come across from video capture software for video conferencing to game play footage. It also happens with a lot of phone footage as well. It's done to save storage space but doesn't play well with video editing programs in general.

Ray.

Hi Ray,
Are you telling me that MEP isn't able to work with video files from mobile phones??
How do you explain that this problem occurs randomly and works better with fewer cores?

I have been able to export the whole project a few times with all cores activated, so this might not be an easy one to catch, but when I do the export, there's a big chanse that the application hangs whithin 1 - 1.5 hours of rendering.

/Christian

@Chrilles

Hi Christian.

The codecs that produce these files are not standard variants of the codec but specifically changed by the manufacturers of either the software involved for a particular phone and designed to be used on the phone or edited with an app designed for the phone. These apps and the products that produce them can read the files correctly and their codecs are generally not given to other developers as the ability to produce smaller files on a given phone can be seen as a competitive edge. Most video editing packages designed to work with the standard constant frame rate codecs cannot read the file information correctly without them.

You have a file that in some sections is only recording four frames per second where there should be thirty. In other places it is putting forty three frames into that second as the movement / action within the frame increases.

Can you see the problem? Which frames should the program drop when there are too many frames for the export settings within that time period within the file and how does it produce images for the missing frames when there are too few? Without being able to have the codec variant the phone uses it can't.

This problem has only occurred during the last few generations of phones. Some game capturing programs and screen capture programs have also adopted this method but can be set up within most of those programs not to. It does increase the storage space needed for such files but at least they can be easily edited with most video editing packages.

MEP and a majority of other video editing packages can not cope with those codec variants. Some mobile phones allow the user to select to record a non compressed file that is not variable frame rate and those can be fine. If your phone (If your files have come from a phone) has such a setting I suggest you use it or use a dedicated program like Handbrake that can amend the files and produce a file an NLE can work with.

The problem is random because when the mismatch of frames is much less the program can predict how to draw one or two extra frames or bin one but not wider amounts. So if there is a lot of movement within a clip for its entire duration it is less likely to be a problem as more frames are recorded per second to cope with recording the movement.

As for the core problem. I can only report I have no problem with the eight cores (sixteen logical cores) on my Intel i9900K processor.

Above is what Task Manager is reporting while I export an MP4 file from MEP and it's breakdown of processes and use of the GPUs.

Another video editing package may be designed to work differently but often if a processor is newer than an editing packages coding, there can be problems that need ironing out as the software developers catch up with the hardware requirements. Those tend to be a part of patches released later or included in new versions of the programs when they are released.

I haven't used an AMD processor since 1998 so not really qualified to answer your specific question on that but in the past I had older programs that could not run on a pc that had multiple cores as the program could not use the architecture.

Everything is a catch up cycle. Often software developers are well behind what the hardware can do. Early adopters of new tech often find these problems occur when dealing with the files the tech produces. The newer Go-Pro Hero 9 is another example but at least has it's own software that can be used as a basic editor.

Please remember we are only other users here, not Magix staff. We can only recognise where a problem is occurring based on past experience with dealing with other users queries and extensive testing of reported problems ourselves to see if there are workarounds we can recommend to the people having problems.

If it is a bug in the program some people here will report it to Magix in the hope they will produce a bug fix in an update. Sometimes a fix is forthcoming from Magix but some reported bugs seem never to be fixed.

If you find you have a specific complaint it's best to get in touch with Magix themselves as all we can do is advise as to what we think is happening and ways if possible, to work around some problems other users have.

Ray.

Hi Ray,

That might be an explanation but unfortunately not a solution.
So how do I move on to make a bug report?

/Christian

@Chrilles

Hi Christian.

It's not a bug.

It's an unsupported file variance of an established codec made to be compatible only with support of the manufacturer of the hardware. It's a well known problem and few video editing packages outside of Adobe Premier Pro can deal with them. Even they have problems when new variants come out. Hence Go-Pro producing their own basic editor. Go to the online forums and find out or do a google search.

The main solution is to get the equipment to switch to constant frame rate recording (It is still an option on some phones) or convert the files using handbrake. The codec was developed to deal with recording the varying frame rates that occur during online game playing. I'm not sure it was ever meant originally for recording phone footage.

Ray.

Hi Ray,

Unfortunately this hang is not caused by the mobile phone videos. I created a new project and I had only video clips from a pro-camera (like DSC_8509_910C39D7.MOV above) and added some .wav-files and some scrolling text.
After beeing working with MEP for about 2 hours, I had exactly the same hang as before.

As mention before, this hang occurs randomly and can occur either when I'm editing or rendering.
I'm aware of that this might be a tricky one to cach but as a software developer for more than 20 years, I'm pretty sure that this is a deadlock bug! I've been there many times myself 😉

To be sure that the amount of memory should't be a problem, I've now upgraded my computer to 32GB RAM.

I also want to mention that I have successfully been able to render my old project several times, with and without my mobile videos and I don't see any difference if I have such clips in the project or not.

Regards,
Christian

@Chrilles

Hi Christian.

The file extension DSC suggests to me a Canon Camera. Is that the case? We have seen another user that had these problems with the files from a Pro Canon camera quite a few months back I think it was the newest Pro full frame DSLR. I think the files had a higher bit depth than usual if I remember correctly but can't remember what or if there was a solution.

@johnebaker @emmrecs

Does that ring a bell with either of you? Can you remember the topic thread?

Ray.

Hi Ray,

The camera is a Nikon D7100
I don't know anything about another thread about a similar topic. This is (as far as I can remember) the only one I've been involved in.

Regards,
Christian

@Chrilles

Hi Christian.

Stupid me. I don't know where I got the impression that DSC was Canon. I should know as I have a D500.

Then that is odd as I don't have any problems with my D500 video files in MEP.

Looking back at your earlier post, the D7100 file is constant frame rate but the other one isn't. Mixing the 'other' file type within a project before converting it to a constant frame rate file may be causing the crashes.

I didn't say you had anything to do with the other topic, I just wanted a reference to it to have a look at that problem to see if there was a connection between the two problems.However that was my mistake and no longer relevant. Sorry for any confusion it caused.

Ray.

@CubeAce

Hi Ray

. . . . The file extension DSC  . . . .

I assume you mean Prefix not extension - DSC = Digital Still Camera.

John EB

@Chrilles

I downloaded a sample 1080p video file for that camera from here, opened it it MEP 20.0.1.73, and it played without problem. I accept this file may have been "processed" by YT so, if you are able to post anywhere (not to the forum) a short sample file for other users to download, we can test it on our systems.

@CubeAce

Hi Ray.

No. I honestly don't remember any such thread.

Jeff

Hi Ray,

As mention, I have only my Nikon videos in this project and this is not a crash, it's a deadlock.
When it happens, I have to kill the application using Windows taskmanager because the application does not respond.

Jeff: In general it works fine but, as mention, it can randomly hang. Normally it takes a while. Sometimes after hours of working. Sometimes when I render, but defenetly not always!

Regards,
Christian