Thanks John.

Hmm, that's almost 30% longer to export. I'll do another comparison with a simple test project.

EDIT: Test result

Project: 20 JPGs, all 4 s duration, with 1s crossfades
Duration: 73 s
Project settings identical in both cases: MPEG-4-Export (MP4)
Video: H.264; 1920x1080p; 50 frames/s; VBR 26000 kbit/s; hardware encoding
Audio: AAC; Stereo; 44100 Hz; 160 kbit/s
MEP 2016 P export time: 47 s
MEPP export time: 85 s
80% longer

Don't think I'll be switching to MEPP 16.0.4.102 (UDP3) any time soon!

Terry, East Grinstead, UK

Hi Terry

. . . . Hmm, that's almost 30% longer to export. . . . .

It is ~50% faster - from ~52 fps to 72 fps render speed.

Using your image example starting with 20 images 3840x2160, 1 sec crossfade on all, exporting to the same parameters as you, new project in both MEP's, I get the following export times

MEP 2016 - 34 secs

MEPP - 32 secs

MEPP is approx 6% faster

Using HWA on Intel HD4600 and the Intel HD codec (Default) - no point in trying it with the MC codec gives 0 byte files when using HWA on the HD 4600.

John EB

Hi John,

That's so dramatically different to my comparison! I'll discuss further tomorrow. Must be some major difference in our settings?

Terry, East Grinstead, UK

Hi Terry

Very interesting. Concurrently I have been wondering if my HW exports have become slower in VPX possibly since the last update to that (I think MEPP and VPX now have the same video engine).

Also I have been following a thread in the German Forum where a fairly knowledgeable member thought that his rendering had slowed by about 50% in MEPP but thought it was something to do with his dual monitor setup and 2 x GPU's - saying that if he had only the iGPU enabled it was as fast as previously.

Even more strange is that as in your other thread today, among this I was trying to test relative speeds using the Magix Demo_ Project I had used previously when comparing with John EB's setup, when I tried to open the Demo Project again in MEP2016 I also got some strange window I had not seen before saying something like "No memory..... blahblah".

I will continue to try to get to the bottom of both questions.

Hi Peter,

Many thanks for the feedback, especially about that inconsistent memory message. Look forward to hearing more about this.

Meanwhile today, apart from my H0/HDP issue discussion with John EB, I'm determined to have a day off from technical glitches/tests/experiments and make some progress on my current project - given my backlog of five holiday videos!

P.S: Yesterday I transferred my historical ProgramData to MEPP, although I've not yet revised my affected macros. Anyway, I'm resolved to continue working in MEP 2016 for time being, forum discussions excepted.

Terry, East Grinstead, UK

Hi

. . . .when I tried to open the Demo Project again in MEP2016 I also got some strange window I had not seen before saying something like "No memory..... blahblah" . . . .

No problem here.

. . . . rendering had slowed by about 50% in MEPP . . . .

With the Demo project, exporting to FullHD 25fps MP4 (default options), HWA on HD4600, Intel HD codec (Default) I get the following:

MEP 2016, MEPP and VPX8 all take 80 secs (ave of 3 runs on each) = ave render speed of ~ 33 fps.

I did read in one post that if you have the Calculate video effects on GPU turned on in the export dialog can slow rendering down.

However, I cannot replicate this as testing with the Demo project shows that, with this option turned on, rendering is ~ 2 secs faster

HTH

John EB

Intriguing! Will break my resolve and try again when I get home this afternoon.

Note that my test used 50 fps.

Hi John, Peter,

"With the Demo project,..."

"...using the Magix Demo_ Project..."

I want to ensure I'm testing with the same 'Demo project' and the same settings as both of you. Is it C:\ProgramData\MAGIX\Movie Edit Pro Premium\2017\_Demo\_Demo.MVP, size 1263 KB, 104 s duration? Or C:\ProgramData\MAGIX\Movie Edit Pro Premium\2017\_Demo_3D\_Demo_3D.MVP, 361 KB, 14 s? Or some other?

"...exporting to FullHD 25fps MP4 (default options),..."

With _Demo.MVP project loaded, File > Export > Video as MPEG-4 offers me
MPEG-4-Export (MP4)
Video: H.264; 512x288p; 25 frames/s; VBR 6000 kbit/s; hardware encoding
Audio: AAC; Stereo; 48000 Hz; 128 kbit/s
Size estimate: 260146 kByte
by default, (with same 512 x 288 resolution as source material), not 'FullHD'.

HWA on HD4600, Intel HD codec (Default)..."

Here, Program Settings > Display Options > Video mode shows
Standard mode (Direct3D, hardware acceleration)
Intel(R) HD Graphics 530

As I had them loaded in MEP 2016 I went ahead and exported that project anyway and it took 24 s. (Same with 'Calculate video effects on GPU' unchecked.)

The 3D demo took 14 s.

The respective durations with MEPP were 28 s and 15 s. Far less difference than my 1920 x 1080 comparison.

Terry, East Grinstead, UK

Hi Terry

. . . . C:\ProgramData\MAGIX\Movie Edit Pro Premium\2017\_Demo\_Demo.MVP, size 1263 KB, 104 s duration? . . . .

That is the one I am using.

. . . . HWA on HD4600, Intel HD codec (Default)..." Here, Program Settings > Display Options > Video mode . . . .

That is the wrong tab, the codec used is on the Import/Export tab in MEP 2016 and MEPP and the options are Default or MainConcept (if you have it installed), Default = Intel HD codec

I rerun the tests exporting to the same settings as you:

The results are:

MEP 2016 - 29s

MEPP - 34s

VPX - 28 s

Why the difference between MEP 2016 and MEPP is puzzling! I have run this one several times with the same result.

For the 3D demo the results for 2016, MEPP and VPX are tha same at 18 secs

HTH

John EB

Hi John,

Thanks. That adds more puzzling data! Maybe we'll see results from Peter and others.

Biggest mystery to me is my 20 images test, which appeared to show MEPP 80% slower.

Terry

Hi Terry

Puzzling indeed!

.. . . Biggest mystery to me is my 20 images test . . . .

Should have asked earlier - are the images standard jpegs from a camera or a smartphone?

John EB

Morning John,

Just an arbitrary set of photos from the first folder I had at hand. I think all taken with an old relatively low res camera. But here is the actual project and media for you and others to unzip and then run TestExportSpeed-20JPGsCrossFaded.MVP

Edit a few minutes later:

I obviously wasn't counting correctly when I made that earlier project - it had 24 JPGs not 20! (I should have done the check sum: 19x3 + 4 = 61, not 73 = 23x3 + 4)

I've now just made another using higher res JPG photos taken with my iPhone. That (which does contain 20 photos, total duration now 61 s) took 44 s to export, same settings.

I'll back it up if you want.

Terry, East Grinstead, UK

Hi Terry

. . . . I'll back it up if you want. . . . .

If you would please - it would be good for comparison and completeness.

Thanks

John EB

Ok John, will do it in the morning.

Hi All

I have been busy doing multiple tests with the Demo project (and some of my own FullHD 1920x1080 50p footage) with the 3 respective programs and exporting to the Demo project default 512x288p 6000kbps template and an HD template. Unfortunately the HD templates are not consistent across the programs in respect of bit rate and resolution when opening the MPEG4 export so we need to establish a standard or be clear about all the parameters - I am a little confused - have you done any HD exports of the Demo or are the figures mentioned all the Demo default low res, low 6000 BR as mentioned above?

I could not get the Demo Project to load in MEP16 as it came up with the "No Memory allocation...." window that Terry first mentioned, it loaded okay in VPX and MEPP after copying it from the MEP16 Program data to VPX etc., so I decided to compare the 1187KB .MVD to an MEP16 auto backup from last year. I found this was only 891KB and that it opened and saved at this size as the new Demo .MVD.

My point here is that whatever increased the size of the file may impact on the projects render speed so we need to be sure we are working with the original file. Unfortunately I did not download the Demo Project in the installation manager in MEPP or VPX originally so cannot compare it to any other downloaded version.

Further I wonder if the new 16bit depth effects processing in VPX (and I think MEPP??) could be extending render times in these later versions, and is responsible for the increase in file size of the Demo project and its ability to not load in MEP16 once it has been opened in MEPP or VPX9.

I am still collating results and hope to post these soon.

Peter

Hi John,

Here's the later backup and media:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/4e3k6xaeudncbkj/TestSpeed20LargerJPGs.zip?dl=0

Project to run after unzipping: TestExportSpeed-20LargerJPGsCrossFaded.MVP

Hi Peter,

Just to be sure, by 'Demo Project' I assume you mean the '_Demo.MVP, size 1263 KB, 104 s duration' project? (I had been unsure because of John's initial reference to 'Full HD'.) I'd suggest we include filename, size (from File Explorer) and duration whenever there's any chance of ambiguity.

--------------------

In case you think it worth trying another source, here's my version of '_Demo.MVP, size 1263 KB, 104 s duration' : https://www.dropbox.com/s/lat4ya40z8b0x7c/_Demo.zip?dl=0

(There are two copies, for MEP 2016 and MEPP. Both are identical in size, to the byte, but who knows what they're like at the sub-atomic level, so...)

--------------------

With that project loaded in MEP 2016, using File > Export Movie > Video as MPEG-4..., I changed res to 1920 x 1080 and fps to 50. The export took 88 s, compared with 24 s for the 'official' demo I reported earlier.

--------------------

Very interesting to hear that you too got that strange memory message.

--------------------

Haven't come across '16-bit depth' before; will have to read up about it. But not today as going out to listen to some lunch time jazz over a drink. 🙂

Terry, East Grinstead, UK

Hi Terry

Thanks for the image project - all exports as per your settings:

MPEG-4-Export (MP4)
Video: H.264; 1920x1080p; 50 frames/s; VBR 26000 kbit/s; hardware encoding
Audio: AAC; Stereo; 44100 Hz; 160 kbit/s:

Results are:

MEP 2016 - 32 secs

MEPP - 32 secs

VPX - 35 secs (for comparison with MEPP only).

Out of curiosity, without changing anything else, I then turned on Calculate video effects on GPU, in the export dialog and this resulted in an increase render times to 72 secs for MEP 2016 and MEPP and 76 secs VPX.

Definitely need to keep that option tuned off.

HTH

John EB

Thanks John. I'll try it tomorrow with that OFF. But it's odd, because it made no difference to that first test I reported.

Hi Terry

Thanks for posting the link to your version of the Demo project .MVD and that was what I was referring too. However I have done some more checking of the File sizes for that Demo and it's folder in earlier versions where I could find them and whilst I believe they are the same project I find a big range of sizes for the .MVD and the "_Demo" project folder - from 891KB in MEP16 back ups to 1.49MB in MEP2014 Program data, and several sizes in between. The project folders range from 109MB in MEP17 HD to 122MB in MEPP (which is a folder copied from MEP16 where it is only 118MB!

So somehow saving the projects changes their size even though you have not altered the project material. Hopefully the effect on render times is small and this will remain a mystery for now.

Anyway some numbers with Demo project of 104secs:

MEP16 Intel HW 25p 512x288 6000kbps                    25secs

MEP16 Intel HW 25p 512x288 6000kbps FXonGPU    25secs

MEPP Intel HW 25p 512x288 6000kbps                    23secs

MEPP Intel HW 25p 512x288 6000kbps FXonGPU    26secs

VPX9 Intel HW 25p 512x288 6000kbps                    24secs

VPX9 Intel HW 25p 512x288 6000kbps FXonGPU    27secs

So very similar render times across 3 NLE versions when exporting to Lo Res file, and little change when switching in FX on GPU on my rig where the discreet NVidia card is doing the parallel processing of the timeline GPU accelerated FX and the iGPU is doing the HW QSV encoding. Note that using this setup there is some gain in Full HD HW and SW  renders, but more on that later 

Hi John,

Using MEP 2016 I ran TestExportSpeed-20LargerJPGsCrossFaded.MVP again as promised. The only change was unchecking 'Calculate video effects on GPU'. Export time decreased from 88 to 25 s. Big difference as you say, John. Interesting that those compare respectively to your 72 (faster than mine) and 32 (slower than mine).

Hi Peter,

Thanks for those tests. Virtually identical to my 24 s.

Interesting that MEPP and VPX9 are successively a tad slower.

I'm guessing you'd get similar results with TestExportSpeed-20LargerJPGsCrossFaded.MVP

(Remember: I have no separate graphics card. Which I believe is true for John's PC too.)

Terry, East Grinstead, UK

Hi Terry

Ran your TestExportSpeed-20LargerJPGsCrossFaded.MVP in MEP16 with your settings:-

Intel HW             = 23secs

Intel HW+FXGPU  = 30secs (wouldn't expect anything else here as your project has no effects)

Hi John

I have finally fallen foul of your 0Byte .MP4 file with MC HWA - I have not seen this before because I nearly always export to .MTS which worked fine on Terrys JPG test:-

Mainconcept .MTS HWA       =21secs

Mainconcept .MTS HWA+FXGPU  =26secs

Peter